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Discussion Starter #1
Has anyone here used the V&H Pro Pipe? I'm looking to get one for my 09' Classic but I don't want it to be "Harley Loud".

Thanks
Rob
 

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The pro-pipe will make great power and torque over a dual set up. It's hard to say how loud it will be since all exhaust is now going thru 1 chamber. If I had a Vaquero I would do the pro pipe. I put a cobra 2into1 power pipe (similar) On my wifes 750 and it sounds great! Better than My VV with tri-ovals and my VTX1300 with Jug-huggers (Bubs pipes). No kidding
 

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I put one on my Vaquero and it is awesome. It has a real deep tone and its isnt over loud its about perfect for me. Plus you cant go wrong with the extra horse over the slip ons. I had one on my Meanstreak as well and loved it on that too. Highly recommended.
 

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Thanks. My buddy has Cobra 'Long Shots' on his C90 and it's too loud and pitchy for me.

I used to have a Brocks Megaphone on my Hayabusa and it was amazing!! The bike sounded like it was a Big Block Chevy. I was hoping the V&H would have the same effect.

Rob
 

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I put one on my Vaquero and it is awesome. It has a real deep tone and its isnt over loud its about perfect for me. Plus you cant go wrong with the extra horse over the slip ons. I had one on my Meanstreak as well and loved it on that too. Highly recommended.
Did you have s/ons on your skoot before you installed the pro pipe, and if so what kind? If your comment about the increase in power was over the s/ons, where in the powerband did you notice the improvements? How is your ability to hear the stereo?

What other performance mods do you have? I have lots done to my Vaquero, even modified the Cobra s/o baffles and i like what i have, but I am always lookin for more. The 2-1 will drop ALOT of weight off the skoot and that is a real good thing.

If i do this i will make comparisons on my dyno and report back.

OH YEA...how bout a pic please?
THANX
RACNRAY
 

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Its all a seat of the pants feeling. I am still riding around letting auto tune make its suggestions. I can hear the radio just fine while riding at 75. VOX is set at 2 and VOL at 14 with the IPOD attached.

I used to have a dyno myself but no longer do so I went with the Auto Tune so I wouldnt have to pay the big price to have it mapped. I also think that the auto tune is going to replace the dyno at some point. I put a Thunder MFG round air cleaner PC V auto tune and the 2 into 1. I will post pic after a bit I have to take them off the camera. The install for all the items were very simple to me. Took about 2.5 hours total. The fit on the pipe was perfect I was very happy with that. I will also see if I can get a video going for the sound. Very low grunt but muffled and not obnoxious.

I get most of my parts from www.lewiscustomcycles.com Ronnie over there is very nice and his prices are hard to beat for those looking for great prices.

Here is the link to my photobucket with some pics. I will be adding more later today.
http://s245.photobucket.com/albums/gg73/mknnoyz/2011 Kawasaki Vaquero/
 

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I ordered a V&H 2-1 yesterday. I will of course perform back to back dyno evaluations and a weight comparison. Hopefully my modified Cobra slip-ons will then be up for sale!!

Pipe should be in late next week, then phase 4 will begin!!

RACNRAY
 

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I ordered a V&H 2-1 yesterday. I will of course perform back to back dyno evaluations and a weight comparison. Hopefully my modified Cobra slip-ons will then be up for sale!!

Pipe should be in late next week, then phase 4 will begin!!

RACNRAY
I thought you posted in another thread you were finished with the power mods....LOL ;)
 

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I ordered a V&H 2-1 yesterday. I will of course perform back to back dyno evaluations and a weight comparison. Hopefully my modified Cobra slip-ons will then be up for sale!!

Pipe should be in late next week, then phase 4 will begin!!

RACNRAY
Looking forward to hearing your report, thanks for sharing! I'm either looking at the V&H slip-ons or the pro pipe. A lot of people that have heard both like the V&H slip-ons over the Cobra slip-ons, but a lot of people like the Tri-Ovals also. I'm still saving my pennies so this is all interesting to me.
James
 

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I thought you posted in another thread you were finished with the power mods....LOL ;)
As my dad would say..."you thought WRONG", and of course so do I all the time!! I am on the never ending quest for more, specially in the power and handling departments.!!

Looking forward to hearing your report, thanks for sharing! I'm either looking at the V&H slip-ons or the pro pipe. A lot of people that have heard both like the V&H slip-ons over the Cobra slip-ons, but a lot of people like the Tri-Ovals also. I'm still saving my pennies so this is all interesting to me.
James
You mite be interested in my Cobra slip-ons. As made by Cobra they were wimpy in sound and performance, once i changed the baffles they sound so mean i get people commenting all the time. They sound like no other!!

RACNRAY
 

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Someone previously in another thread months ago took their V.V stock exhaust and converted it into a single. 2 into 1 with baffle mods. He stated a huge difference in performance over the stock set up. Better torque and stronger pull. He also liked looking at that side of the bike with the muffler removed. The Vance&Hines should prove to be the ticket with your mods. Especially in the accelleration dept. Look forward to your Dyno test!
 

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I'd be interested to see how he modified the collector, if any mods were done.There is an imbalance of ex flow between the left and right mufflers, and in getting down to look at the way Kawi has the collector designed, it is
horrible from a performance standpoint.

I will also be taking measurements of both systems and comparing, especially the primary tubes. The stock primaries are about 1 3/4" o.d. all the way to the collector, the V&H use stepped primaries which mean the diameter of the pipe as it leaves the exhaust port is smaller than further down the length of the tube where the two are joined. This keeps exhaust velocity high as it leaves the ex port, allows for more flow volume when the exhaust reaches the larger diameter tubing. It will be interesting to see if the initial diameter is the same size as stock with the tubing getting larger than stock, or if the intial diameter is smaller than stock with the same size larger tubing. Stepped primaries are a cheaper but not as effective as tapered primary tubes, but both offer benefits over a single diameter primary tube.

One thing that can complicate seat-of-the-pants performance evaluations...when a substantial amount of weight is removed form a skoot acceleration is instantly approved. Combining dyno evaluations with real world impressions and knowing how much weight was removed tells the whole story.

I am looking forward to this next phase. I am a firm believer in thermal wrapping of exhausts, i am hoping that will be possible with the V&H system. I hope the heat shields will allow room to wrap the primaries.

OH GOSH...MORE TO COME!!

RACNRAY
 

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Initial measurements

V&H pro pipe came in today.

First of all it has a very interesting and well thought out baffle, tho it does have a restrictor cap welded in to prevent the baffle from being a straight thru design. That may have to be either eliminated or at least a hole drilled in it to allow for: (A) more power if it does not match the power of my current set-up...(B) to allow my exhaust probe to protrude further into the exhaust for a more accurate reading.

It is a stepped primary tube design, tho V&H has made the transition to the larger diameter pipe quite a ways from the exhaust ports. The primaries are 1 3/4" o.d. which is the same as stock, the larger section of primary is 1 7/8" o.d. The front cylinder steps up to the larger diameter 9" from the collector, the rear 5.5" away. I will be measuring the i.d. of the stock and V&H primaries as sometimes there is a small difference due to wall thickness.

I am waiting on exhaust port gaskets which may be in tomorrow or thursday, so before and after dyno runs will have to wait, maybe till next week.:(

MORE TO COME

RACNRAY
 

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Got the gaskets, my mechanic is wrapping the primary tubes on the 2-1 as i type this. Have to let the wrapping dry and then paint it to look ,well, kinda nice. Will have the pipe on tomorrow for follow up runs to see what the differences are.
Skoot is goin onto the dyno for new follow up dyno runs when he is finished with the wrapping. I just changed the oil so the skoot will probably be down 2-4 H.P. due to the new oil. We shall see.

Wrapping drying before painting. We left spaces unwrapped for where the heat shields sit on the pipe.



RACNRAY
 

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Baseline dyno runs

I just did the new follow up dyno runs and as i suspected the skoot lost about 2 H.P. thru most of the run, typical when a fresh oil change has been done. Mark is removing the exhaust, we will weigh it and the V&H 2-1 and report the weight diff.

I am VERY interested in the results tomorrow, i surely hope the power increase is worth the time and $$.

RACNRAY
 

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I saw the pro pipe available to pre order from phats but the only pipes listed for the 09 and up classic/lt are Bigshots on the V&H website. They're much more expensive than Cobra's pipes also. You're looking at about ~$488 for a set of Cobra Speedster Slashdowns vs. ~$600 for a set of V&H Bigshots. They both use their own version of a crossover to "mimic" 2 into one. Not sure which option is better. The pro-pipe has a long reputation from V&H as being their best performing pipe and the dyno numbers to prove it. I like the two into two look much better on the classic though. I'll probably go with the Bigshots. I've had them on another bike and was happy with them. I just wish they weren't the most expensive offering for the Classic!
 

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Weight difference

The weight diff is 13.5 pnds, not as much as i had hoped for but i'll take anything. On sportbikes we have found that a 5 pnd weight loss can be felt in the handling, so 13.5 will help me throw this skootaround better.

RACNRAY
 

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Discussion Starter #19
The weight diff is 13.5 pnds, not as much as i had hoped for but i'll take anything. On sportbikes we have found that a 5 pnd weight loss can be felt in the handling, so 13.5 will help me throw this skootaround better.

RACNRAY
I can't wait for the dyno results!!
Thanks for all your time and hard work.

Rob
 

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Initial dyno results of the V&H 2-1

First off, it has a nice tone, loud but not too loud. A good rumble but not as "barky" or loud as my modified Cobra s/ons. And there in lies the problem.

This 2-1 DOES make more power than a completely stock exhaust, but it DOES NOT make the power of a good set of STRAIGHT THRU slip-ons, at least my s/ons. My slip-ons have straight-thru 2" cores, prolly very similar to the cores i have seen used in the Tri-Ovals. If there are other s/ons with the same core size and design, then they may also have better power than this 2-1.

There is no loss from 1000 rpm to 2600, but the loss starts @ 2600 and extends all the way to 4800 rpm!

@3000rpm, 3hp and 5.2 pnds LESS
@3500rpm, 2.5 hp and 3.7 pnds LESS
@4000rpm, 1.7hp and 2pnds LESS

Now...the muffler core has a block-off plate that prevents it from being a straight thru design. I first drilled two 1/2' holes to allow more ex flow and to allow my ex probe to go deep into the muffler for accurate ex sampling. This provided very little gain in power. I next removed the baffle, cut the welds holding the block-off plate and removed it.

Follow up runs showed a nice gain in that area where i had the substantial loss. Power loss is now limited to 2600-3600 rpm with the largest deficit of 1.7 hp and 3.4 pnd torque.There is about a 1 HP gain up top where i don't visit that much. The only problem with this baffle mod is the exhaust sound is now MUCH louder than my modified slip-ons. So i must now perform the same type mod to this pipe i did on my s/ons. V&H uses a VERY short baffle with a 2 1/4" core. Today i orderd two feet of 2 1/2" core, i will make a new core that extends from the front of the muffler body all the way to the end cap and have packing around it. Hopefully the increase in inside diameter will allow the engine to make more power, and the longer baffle with the packing will quiet the sound.

In all fairness the loss in midrange power may not be all attributed to this pipe, the a/f ratio went SUBSTANTIALLY RICH in the rpm range where there is a power loss. If this muffler mod was not too loud i'd just go ahead and remap, but i will not be able to live with the noise. At it's riichest point it dropped down to 11.7-1, more than a full point TOO rich!!

I just came back from a test ride and here are my impressions...If the baffle supplied with this pipe was not so restrictive(again as compared to my modfied s/ons), the sound would be just about perfect. My mod to this baffle deffinately increases the noise over my s/ons but not as bad as i thought. But yes it is too loud.

The first thing i noticed was the loss of the 13.5 pounds of weight. I can feel the skoot is more flickable, more so than i thought it would be. Very nice and i'll have to get used to it!

Some nice improvements...the engine feels much smoother and revs a bit quicker and feels more eager in the low throttle/low rpm areas with less shuddering. Going up overpasses the cruise control does not seem to have to increase engine rpm as much and for a shorter period of time. The engine IS running more effieciently in those areas even tho i still have to remap.

The wrapped primary tubes allow MUCH less heat on me and there is a slight lowering of coolant temp. especially when sitting still at a light.

So at this point i can say this pipe offers NO advantage in power over a pair of hi-flow slip-ons,especially if they have at least 2" cores.If you have good s/ons as described installing this exhaust will be money wasted unless the look, which IS WAAAY cool is more appealing than a dual muffler set-up, and the weight savings also an important aspect.

The weight savings that aided in handling i really did appreciate. The smoother running and a bit better throttle response is a plus. I will put some miles on it to analize the mpg before i do the baffle mod and remap next week, so the final outcome is, uh, yet to come!!

RACNRAY
 
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