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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all,

I want some advice, but i am also writing this out to organize my thoughts.

I bought my first bike back at the end of September from a local dealer. Since then I decided that i wanted to buy a house this year and went to sell my bike to a different local dealer.
I was given a value of 300 bucks because the title says 120400 miles, instead of the 12040 that the bike actually has. The dealer messed up the registration / title.

I reached out to the selling dealer on the 3rd of December to get it fixed.I was told " No problem, we'll sort it out". The person i was working with quit at the end of december after about 20 emails back and forth and no progress. I called last week on thursday to find out what was going on and no one knew anything about it. i forwarded the email chain and was "promised" the new person would call me back the next day. They wanted to call the last person to get more info. On Monday i sent an email , no response. Tuesday i called the salesperson again, was told the person i emailed isnt doing that kind of work anymore and it was some other person. That she'd talk to her, and id hear back ASAP. I posed the idea in december the dealer should just give me bluebook for the bike and deal with it on their own time, raised that again on tuesday. I was told id have an answer when i was called back.

I STILL have not heard anything from the title people. The last actual update i have was on December 23rd first thing in the morning. Anything since has just been me getting the runaround. My plan is to go down tomorrow and speak with the general manager in person and ask them to buy the bike back. They damaged the title and basically made the bike worthless. I have the buyers order clearly stating 12040 miles. Becasue of the weather, being a new rider and parking it after i found out, ive put a wopping 440 miles on the bike. Ive also polished the paint, the chrome, and meticulously cleaned it. Its in better shape now than it was when i bought it.

The dealer i tried to sell it to, told me that the seller should just buy it back for a full refund. Ive been beyond patient with these people.

Any thoughts or advice on how to approach this at this point? Im considering a lawer, but for a 3000k bike i could easily spend more in legal fees than the bike is worth.
 

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My only experience with a title issue, I had to threaten to get a lawyer before anyone did anything. Over 6 months of fighting over it. In the end, I didn't actually have to get one, but I was ready to.
 

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Sabre is right. You have given them plenty of time to deal with the issue. It seems like they are giving you the run around.
The way the current employment situation is, it is possible that they have turned over a lot of people and that's why nothing is getting done.

If I were you I would call and make an appointment with the owner or general manager. Don't waste time on anyone else lest you want more run around. Take copies ( not originals) of all your pertinent documentation ( sales invoice, emails sent and received, etc.). Explain what you have done previously to get this straightened out and the run around you have received. Be forceful, direct and to the point and tell the owner/manager what you expect to be done. Also tell them the date you expect this to be handled by or you will be filing a lawsuit in small claims court and a summons will be sent to him shortly.. As long as you have the proper the documentation the law is on your side.

Almost all states have a small claims court system which means you don't have to hire a lawyer. You can in a simple way have a court hearing before a judge that you do not have to know or abide by all the rules and regulations and protocols of a regular court case. It usually costs around a $100.00 to file the lawsuit at your local courthouse and to have the summons served on the owner/manager.

I own a business and have had to do this a number of times to collect bad debts and only once had to actually appear in court. Once a business gets the summons they usually settle very quickly with you before the scheduled court date.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I actually already made copies of the buyers order, the registration etc. I even broke down and reached out to an old professor who happens to be a lawyer asking if he can help or reccomend someone who can.

My plan is to go down there meet with him, show him the registration, the sales order, and the lack of communication. The bottom line will be something like: "I want you to buy the bike as is, for fair market value. If you can fix the title, it wont be an issue for you, if you cant, you'll have to refund the cost anyway. If you cant do that, my next stop will be filing with claims court/my lawyer."
 

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Personally, I've had better results almost universally with the "I really need your help with this..." approach rather than barge in all demanding and such.

Have you checked with your state DMV on what it takes to correct an odometer discrepancy? There is usually good info on their website.

Where I live it you can print out a simple form from the DMV for some title corrections, including odometer discrepancy, and all that's needed from the seller is their signature. Then you can send it in.

If there is similar process in your state do that and bring the form to the dealership. Get the signature and be on your way without making a big stink, despite I understand why you'd want to. It's fair to express your concern but likely no need to go off the deep end with demands and threats.
 

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Have you contacted your state's Motor Vehicle Division or vehicle registration office? I would suggest taking all your paperwork to them and show what you have. If your state requires annual vehicle safety inspection they would have a record of the bike's mileage each year it was inspected. Also, they have quite a bit of clout with dealerships. Since you're not getting any cooperation from the dealership, try them. Then, a contact to your state's AG's office might help.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
The person who left the dealership was working with DMV, ultimately she was told she would have to contact state police for inspection records. The main issue there is that most bikes around here just skip the inspection. The other issue is that last update was 3 weeks ago. No progress since. I'll sort it out on my own if i have to, but i paid the dealer 300 dollars to do all the paperwork on a cash sale. I am not doing their jobs for them unless i have no other choice. Finally, I simply dont have time to start over with the DMV.

I dont plan on being nasty with the dealer, ive been extremely polite so far. But im at the point where the GM needs to be involved.
 

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I guess it's your choice to try to expedite the process or not. Maybe we have a different opinion on the value of $300 but my time is worth a lot to me if I can move something along on my schedule rather than rely on someone else.

Have YOU looked at the DMV process? Even if you still choose not to try to do it yourself, at least go in armed with facts rather than hearsay of an ex-employee.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I guess it's your choice to try to expedite the process or not. Maybe we have a different opinion on the value of $300 but my time is worth a lot to me if I can move something along on my schedule rather than rely on someone else.

Have YOU looked at the DMV process? Even if you still choose not to try to do it yourself, at least go in armed with facts rather than hearsay of an ex-employee.
in my opinion weather its hearsay or not, its what was provided in writing by said employee while they were acting on behalf of the company. I will try to verify that before going to the dealer today.
The main issue in terms of time is that the DMV is SLOW. It takes 2 months to get an appointment around here. If i can get the dealer to buy the bike for FMV , and sort it out on their own that saves me time and hassle.

Also to clarify, the value of the bike as a trade in according to blue book is $2100 with the actual mileage. With the titled mileage its worth 300. So were talking about $1800 trade in value and even more private party.
 

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You haven't accomplished anything with the dealership staff and you're obviously frustrated with them, so why continue to rely on them? I have to believe the GM has been made aware of the situation by his staff. If the GM hasn't, then he/she needs new staff. I was always made aware of problem cases such as yours. Most likely he/she is allowing his staff to continue to try and resolve this, but I can tell you they won't continue to push unless you push them. Since your purchase was closed, funded and registered it won't show up on any of the GM's reports to remind him. If you don't want to go the DMV route, then get in to see the GM. He/she should see you with or without an appointment and is the final person in the dealership that can make a decision on a correction or resolution. I can assure you the GM doesn't want to dragged into the middle of this! You've asked for advice, and both @whoaru99 and I have given some to you. The ball's in your court. Good Luck!
 

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One more thing. Keep in mind that the Dealer/Owner is not always the GM. The Dealer hates even worse getting drawn into these things.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I am headed down to speak to the GM this afternoon. Im even leaving work early to do so. I have copied of the buyers (disclosed mileage) and the registration (incorrect mileage) and ill be taking copies of the emails with me as well. If that doesnt work, ill weigh fixing it through dmv (if possible) against filing small claims.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
One more thing. Keep in mind that the Dealer/Owner is not always the GM. The Dealer hates even worse getting drawn into these things.
this place has more than one location, and was recently purchased. So I doubt the owner works there.
 

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Personally, I've had better results almost universally with the "I really need your help with this..." approach rather than barge in all demanding and such.
I agree wholeheartedly. It is possible The GM does not know about the situation
It's always better to start off asking nicely for help. However I would surely express my frustrations with their lack of expedience and let the GM know I expect the matter to be fully resolved within 3-4 days.
If the GM in any way hesitates or fails to be apologetic then it's time to play hardball

Personally I would not go the DMV route. That is the dealerships responsibility. They know the process much better than you and can get it handled quicker. You should not have to be wasting time on this. You have already paid the dealer to do this. They screwed up and it is their responsibility to fix it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I agree wholeheartedly. It is possible The GM does not know about the situation
It's always better to start off asking nicely for help. However I would surely express my frustrations with their lack of expedience and let the GM know I expect the matter to be fully resolved within 3-4 days.
If the GM in any way hesitates or fails to be unapologetic then it's time to play hardball
yeah, im not planning to go in as a jerk. Im just going to set expectations. Ive waited a month and a half for this to be resolved now. either i need a fixed title, or cash in hand by the end of next week.
Im not even asking for a refund, just FMV (trade in). If they can fix the title they have the chance to make another 1500 bucks off of it when the season starts. If they cant fix the title, i save them 1500 bucks from the refund id be rewarded in a legal action. Either way they win.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Just got an email back from them saying they reached out to the state police and should have the documents they need today.

Thoughts on if I should still go down to the GM?
 

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Just got an email back from them saying they reached out to the state police and should have the documents they need today.

Thoughts on if I should still go down to the GM?
That's great news! Since they reached out to you to advise you of movement, I believe I would sit back and wait for awhile. Send them an email back thanking them!

I'm curious... What state are you in? Here in Texas this type of issue is usually corrected with a corrected title application. Very simple and done by the dealership. It states that the dealership provided incorrect information and certifies the new information.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
That's great news! Since they reached out to you to advise you of movement, I believe I would sit back and wait for awhile. Send them an email back thanking them!

I'm curious... What state are you in? Here in Texas this type of issue is usually corrected with a corrected title application. Very simple and done by the dealership. It states that the dealership provided incorrect information and certifies the new information.
Virginia,

DMV requires state inspection records to correct the title mileage. State police should be sending that to her today.

I did thank her for the help. I have tried to be as nice as possible becasue being mean doesnt gain anything. I think ill give them another week. Then ill go talk to the GM and give them till the end of the month for resolution.
 

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Hi all,

I want some advice, but i am also writing this out to organize my thoughts.

I bought my first bike back at the end of September from a local dealer. Since then I decided that i wanted to buy a house this year and went to sell my bike to a different local dealer.
I was given a value of 300 bucks because the title says 120400 miles, instead of the 12040 that the bike actually has. The dealer messed up the registration / title.

I reached out to the selling dealer on the 3rd of December to get it fixed.I was told " No problem, we'll sort it out". The person i was working with quit at the end of december after about 20 emails back and forth and no progress. I called last week on thursday to find out what was going on and no one knew anything about it. i forwarded the email chain and was "promised" the new person would call me back the next day. They wanted to call the last person to get more info. On Monday i sent an email , no response. Tuesday i called the salesperson again, was told the person i emailed isnt doing that kind of work anymore and it was some other person. That she'd talk to her, and id hear back ASAP. I posed the idea in december the dealer should just give me bluebook for the bike and deal with it on their own time, raised that again on tuesday. I was told id have an answer when i was called back.

I STILL have not heard anything from the title people. The last actual update i have was on December 23rd first thing in the morning. Anything since has just been me getting the runaround. My plan is to go down tomorrow and speak with the general manager in person and ask them to buy the bike back. They damaged the title and basically made the bike worthless. I have the buyers order clearly stating 12040 miles. Becasue of the weather, being a new rider and parking it after i found out, ive put a wopping 440 miles on the bike. Ive also polished the paint, the chrome, and meticulously cleaned it. Its in better shape now than it was when i bought it.

The dealer i tried to sell it to, told me that the seller should just buy it back for a full refund. Ive been beyond patient with these people.

Any thoughts or advice on how to approach this at this point? Im considering a lawer, but for a 3000k bike i could easily spend more in legal fees than the bike is worth.
I would call the attorney generals office in your state. Explain your issue. They can get things moving. As for the other dealer offering you so much less then what it is worth stay away. Good luck with the house.
 

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Hi all,

I want some advice, but i am also writing this out to organize my thoughts.

I bought my first bike back at the end of September from a local dealer........


If I were you I would:

1) Make notes with dates and times of each and every conversation you have had thus far and a general overview of what was discussed and agreed to and promised by both sides.
(Example: Jan 10,2022 11:50AM Joshua Peters (Sales Person) Explained bought bike, gave details of sale (Invoice number etc). Bike odometer showed "X miles", title says "Y miles". Joshua said, "Blah blah blah" (If you put stuff in quotes make sure that you get it exactly as said otherwise you can write something like, 'Joshua respond that they would look into it and be back to me within 48 hours').
2) Contact the titles office and find out what is required by them to rectify the matter. You may find you do not need the dealer. But if you do:
3) ALL FUTURE CORRESPONDENCE SHOULD BE ONLY IN WRITING. Paper is best since the dealer could claim that they never received your email. Doing everything in writing is so that both parties have a full history of what has been said, acknowledged and agreed to. I CAN NOT STRESS THIS "IN WRITING" ENOUGH. Should the matter end up in court, all of these letters become evidence,
4) If it were me I might be tempted to start my first letter with, "After having exhaustively and unsuccessfully attempted to resolve this matter by phone, on the advice of my lawyer, ALL further discussion of this matter will be in writing. The saga so far has been as follows: (List dates and times of calls and what was discussed and promised.)" If they do not dispute by return written correspondence what you have stated in writing then your assertions, backed by your diary notes, hold significance.
5) You might mention that you were shown and sold a bike that showed X number of miles on the odometer but subsequently given a title that said the mileage was Y. So, which is correct? If the odometer was correct then you have been damaged by a clerical error on behalf of the dealer that is resulting in a significantly reduced resale value. If the title was correct you were defrauded by being sold a bike that was actually different from what you were told and shown.
6) Close each letter with a line that states that you expect a response "by close of business _ / _ / ____". The date you select must allow reasonable period of time for them to respond. Ten days to to weeks is usually acceptable.
6) Keep a copy of every letter sent along with the date on which it was posted. Also keep every written response received.
7) If I had not had the matter resolved within three letters I would go to court and sue for damages and expenses (Your normal hourly rate x the hours you have spent + any travel, correspondence costs, etc. You must itemize everything if you want to claim for it which is an other reason for the diary notes).
 
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