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Discussion Starter #1
For someone that has more time to tinker than me. I started tinkering with the idle but didn't want a permanent change since I ride all winter and the warmup is convienent. I found some 2yo pictures in my camera but not on Photobucket so it's likely I never brought up the idle subject. The annoying fast idle implemented by the same solenoid that operates the secondary throttle plates. The anodized cam in the 1st photo rotates upward to the roller and in turn opens the primary throttle plates.



In the second photo with the throttle opened, to the right of the idle speed adjuster cable, there's a screw with a spring pointing downward. The screw adjusts the dimension between the roller and the cam. Counter-intuitively, turning the screw clockwise increases the roller to cam distance thus dropping the rpms.



Here's where I ran out of time to tinker. I've turned the aforementioned screw 3/4 turn clockwise (it's been two years so hopefully that's where I left off). The ECU won't go down without a fight. Startup idle is slightly above warm idle for 30 seconds. ECU, the rocket speed processor that it is, figures this out after 30 seconds and slightly bumps idle up for another 30 seconds. Once again the ECU figures out the idle is still not where expected and bumps the idle up again...but too late...after 10 seconds it's warmed up.

It's been two years since I've played with it but if someone wants to tinker here's a starting point. Grinding the cam or other permanent modification won't work (probably would but not without blipping the throttle while trying to put on helmet and gloves) for starting in 20deg weather.
 

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I'm still trying to figure out what the problem is. I don't know, I hit the start button, the bike starts and starts to warm. I finish putting my helmet and gloves on, pick the bike off the kickstand, make sure everything is pointed right and all the lights are on and take off. About a minute up the road I have to stop at stop signs and the idle is normally just a little low as the bike isn't quite warmed up yet in the colder weather BUT it's warm by the next light and the bike is idling correctly, gotta be under 5 minutes tops.

What does your bike do that is irritating on the warm up procedure?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
No big problem, half-a$$ed implementation of "features" just annoy me. If I've got oil pressure and take it easy the first few miles I don't need a computer to warm up an engine for me. Fast also idle serves no purpose when the bike is already hot. Touching the throttle long enough for the ECU to look at sensor inputs and rpms seems to restart a 30-second timer and prolong fast idle. Since I work with safety critical systems it annoys me when requirements are bad and/or the implementation is bad. What really bothers me is programming the ECU is not rocket science and "good enough" is acceptable.
 

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I'm still trying to figure out what the problem is. I don't know, I hit the start button, the bike starts and starts to warm. I finish putting my helmet and gloves on, pick the bike off the kickstand, make sure everything is pointed right and all the lights are on and take off. About a minute up the road I have to stop at stop signs and the idle is normally just a little low as the bike isn't quite warmed up yet in the colder weather BUT it's warm by the next light and the bike is idling correctly, gotta be under 5 minutes tops.

What does your bike do that is irritating on the warm up procedure?
For an example, when I would start my '10 SE the engine would race, not just idle fast, for over two minutes before slowly returning to a normal idle. Then, and this I think is dangerous, if I were to stall the engine say at a light with the engine warm and then re-start, the idle would shoot up again for about thirty seconds. This is fine if there's no traffic but when I would take off following a car in front of me I would have to feather the clutch to keep from running into him the idle was that high. I removed the cam and elongated the half moon mounting hole just slightly with a needle file so I could set the cam slightly back from the primary throttle mechanism thus reducing the fast idle. If I find a need to boost the fast idle speed again, I can loosen the nut and rotate the cam back where it was.
 

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I agree with Baitis. Ride all day in 90 deg weather, stop for gas, start bike and the motor is screaming. Makes people think another idiot biker reving the engine. I've never had any FI motor do this, especially when its already warmed up. It just seems like Kawi didn't finish the ECU progamming - left some debug commands in there.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I don't know about debug commands but definitely bugs; hence the problem, bugs with senority are called "features" and seldom, if ever, get fixed in commercial software/firmware.
 

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Mine never exceeds 12-1300 on warm restarts, idle is at 9-1000 so you see, in my experience theres no problem. Sounds like yours has something different going on.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Maybe I'm missing something but even 12-1300 on warm restarts makes my pet peeve list. I don't have a tach. Now that I'm spun up I'll have to find the time to dig in to the electrical system over the winter and come up with a way to trick the ECU. It would be nice to cut one open and reprogram it since the schematics don't give enough info for downloading any code or redesigning.
 

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Maybe something to do with a temp sensor or the way ECU reads it, my bike don't hit high idle after restart when its heated up.There has been a couple times when it didn't idle up when it should have tho.So maybe I have a quirk in my bike that you would like.
 

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With maybe 30 seconds at a couple hundred rpm over the normal 1000 being a problem, yea YOU have a problem. You've got an Fi bike when you want an old carbed one that you have to control the choke on. Like I said, I never noticed there was a problem, now I'm convinced there isn't one.

But I wasn't overly impressed by removing the secondaries either. Heck, I may just be happy with the bike. But then, I do have a cup holder, and scoots pulley, and a Car Tire, and a modulator, and a BAK, and a Bully controller, but I'm happy with MY bike.

Ain't I just a pip?
 

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With maybe 30 seconds at a couple hundred rpm over the normal 1000 being a problem, yea YOU have a problem. You've got an Fi bike when you want an old carbed one that you have to control the choke on. Like I said, I never noticed there was a problem, now I'm convinced there isn't one.

But I wasn't overly impressed by removing the secondaries either. Heck, I may just be happy with the bike. But then, I do have a cup holder, and scoots pulley, and a Car Tire, and a modulator, and a BAK, and a Bully controller, but I'm happy with MY bike.

Ain't I just a pip?
MrClean, consider yourself one of the lucky ones.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
With maybe 30 seconds at a couple hundred rpm over the normal 1000 being a problem, yea YOU have a problem. You've got an Fi bike when you want an old carbed one that you have to control the choke on. Like I said, I never noticed there was a problem, now I'm convinced there isn't one.

But I wasn't overly impressed by removing the secondaries either. Heck, I may just be happy with the bike. But then, I do have a cup holder, and scoots pulley, and a Car Tire, and a modulator, and a BAK, and a Bully controller, but I'm happy with MY bike.

Ain't I just a pip?
As an engineer I'm seldom happy with status quo. I always find a reason to tear something apart, and sometimes I even put it back together.
 

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As an engineer, I leave well enough alone and work on the things I'm responsible for.

Ok, I don't work in engineering anymore, but I used to.

Seriously though, I've run into 10-15 900's locally from 2006 to current (surprised it isn't more but what the heck) and along with everyone being happy with their bike I've yet to hear one that has an excessively high idle on startup, I don't think I'm a lucky one so much as you guys is un-lucky and need to see the dealer. But if you're complaining about a couple hundred rpm and not revving to 2 grand, YOU are the problem. Then again, paralleling my post in another thread, you're pretty much on your own going to the dealer and asking 'Is this normal?' Yup, if I don't have to get off my ass it's normal. "Does this need fixed" No, not if it means I have to get off my ass. "Shouldn't this be warranty" Seriously, you keep up with that potty mouth and I'll have YOUR ass forcibly removed!
 

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Discussion Starter #14
1. Excessive = anything over normal idle speed and especially for no reason
2. Normal, yes. But there's no reason why can't try to change what we don't like. I've never offered an opinion on whether it needs to be fixed or it's a warranty problem because it's neither; it's a characteristic I don't want.
3. If I didn't get up and hide in the garage the wife would make do something like paint a room or 3.
4. I have no idea what I did to piss you off but by all means remove me if that's what floats your boat.
 

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Aaah, I didn't get the impression any of 'em where upset with ya Baitis. Sounds like they were have fun with ya. Personally I didn't see any problem I just figured you were "way" more in tune with your bike than I was. :D
 

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What? Why would you get the idea anyone was upset? Confused originally, then after understanding just conversing. Least I thought I was. Oh I do have a different method of putting a sentence together, but I didn't think any of the above was inflammatory or conveyed being upset.

Again, you bought a computer controlled bike. The bikes ECU doesn't have a memory as to whether you just turned it off or if it's been off for years. The only thing it stores is mileage/trip and time and two of those dis-appear if you take the battery off. So everytime you turn on the ignition it looks at all the sensors, pressurizes the fuel system checks for pressure and prepares to start. You hit the button it turns on (hopefully) and then the computer goes about checking to see if things are going right, if the pressure comes up in the oil, the temp starts to climb on the sensors and if you have a European bike, the O2 sensors are reading right. It all takes a less than a minute usually unless the oil temperature IS low and then it takes however long it takes. It is not un-neccesary rpm unless you have a malfunctioning ECU that's advancing the throttle way high, and I'm thinking close to 2 grand there not under 1300 or so.
But, if you can get into the ECU and reprogram it OR want to work on it so these auto functions are dis-abled, its up to you. It's YOUR bike. And it would be interesting to see the work.
 
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