Synthetic or normal oil? - Page 4 - Kawasaki Vulcan Forum : Vulcan Forums
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post #31 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-02-2019, 08:29 AM
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either dino oil or synthetic oil will both get dirty the same, so extend the drain interval for your synthetic oil and run your bike more miles on dirty oil, it's your motor

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post #32 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-02-2019, 11:18 AM
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One of the benefits, if you can call it that, of synthetic oil is you have longer change intervals.
SO now you're going to jump all over that???


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post #33 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-02-2019, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vulcandoc View Post
One of the benefits, if you can call it that, of synthetic oil is you have longer change intervals.
SO now you're going to jump all over that???

It's not real clear who you're shooting for here but since it was recently alluded to I was busting chops, I'll bite.

Regarding my personal experience with synthetic and extended drain, I refer you to post #22.

Regarding service intervals, most vehicle OEMs do NOT support/endorse extended service intervals based on use of synthetic oil instead of dino oil.

There are lube mfgs, for example Amsoil, that claim to have your back on extended service intervals if you go by their guidelines. But, again, most vehicle OEMs do not support/endorse extended service intervals with synthetic oil.

If the vehicle OEM supports extended drain intervals with synthetic there should be identified intervals specifically for that. If there isn't anything like that in the Owners or Service manuals then it's not supported by the vehicle OEM.

Last edited by whoaru99; 07-02-2019 at 02:01 PM.
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post #34 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-02-2019, 05:42 PM
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The only problem that I see with extended oil changes is contamination , the oil may mantain it's proporties but crap will accumulate nonetheless and it will clog the filter so the oil will circulate through the bypass valve of the filter and that can't be good , so unless you change your filter in between oil changes depending on the driving conditions and top off your oil I would not recomend keeping your oil for that long
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post #35 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-02-2019, 06:49 PM
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After some internet searching I found the info below:

The change intervals listed for most vehicles are for "normal" usage, normal being long trips on level ground at a steady speed. The different vehicle mfgs have similar lists of what constitutes severe, but when driving patterns are "severe" a shortened interval is recommended. None of my 4 wheel vehicles even mention "normal" vs. "severe" schedules, but I found lots of links referring to Ford, Mazda (my vehicles), and other makes having their own versions of lists of what constitutes severe driving conditions. Neither my Kawi owners manual nor the service manual for the Voyager say anything about normal vs severe schedule differences, so it is safer to assume that the schedule is for "normal" riding.

These conditions are usually something like:

1 Frequent idling for long periods of time, such as stop-and-go driving in heavy traffic. Many vehicles are subjected to this condition twice a day in commuting to major cities.
2 Sustained highway driving in hot weather, such as vacation travel.
3 Towing a boat or trailer, carrying heavy objects on a rooftop rack.
4 Driving in dusty conditions, such as dirt or gravel roads.
5 Prolonged operation at sub-zero temperatures.
6 Driving on steep hills or mountains on a regular basis.
7 Regular rapid acceleration (I'm sure none of us know any riders who are hard on the throttle )

AAA estimates that at least 65% of Americans meet enough of these conditions that they should change their oil on the severe schedule (https://newsroom.aaa.com/2009/10/aaa...ot-realize-it/). The Filter Manufactures Council suggests that it is closer to 80% (http://www.baldwinfilter.com/literature/english/10%20TSB's/94-1R1.pdf).

I live in a metropolitan area. Stop and go is all there is around here. When I get on the highways, I am often stuck in barely moving traffic for long periods of time. The hotter the day, the longer the traffic jam seems to last. I haul heavy loads in my truck. I make fairly frequent short (5 - 10 miles) trips. On the motorcycle, once I do get out of town, I like to ride in the mountains of N. GA, N. Ala., and Western North Carolina. I ride in sub-zero weather. I pull a trailer on long trips. The only severe things from the list above I don't usually do is ride dusty roads or gravel roads and hard acceleration (well, most of the time). The Voyager calls for 7500 miles between oil changes. If that is for "normal" riding conditions, then I certainly do not feel like I'm wasting my money by changing the oil on a shorter schedule.

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post #36 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-02-2019, 08:55 PM
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If any given mfg. thought it important to differentiate normal/severe duty I opine they would. Clearly some have.

I doubt others don't differentiate simply because it had not occurred to them.
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post #37 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-02-2019, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Archie View Post
The only problem that I see with extended oil changes is contamination , the oil may mantain it's proporties but crap will accumulate nonetheless and it will clog the filter so the oil will circulate through the bypass valve of the filter and that can't be good , so unless you change your filter in between oil changes depending on the driving conditions and top off your oil I would not recomend keeping your oil for that long
When I ran the extended drain I replaced filters I think 3 or 4 times between oil changes. The filter on that vintage Chevy 4WD was fairly small because it fits above the front driveshaft. Not a whole lot of oil itself is lost/exchanged with just the filter change on those.
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post #38 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-03-2019, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post
If any given mfg. thought it important to differentiate normal/severe duty I opine they would. Clearly some have.

I doubt others don't differentiate simply because it had not occurred to them.
Well, I think that is a rather naive viewpoint. The manual for my 2002 Ford Sport Trac calls for oil changes every 5000 miles. There is no mention at all of any differences for "normal" vs "severe" conditions. However, if I go to the Ford (official) website maintenance section, plug in my miles, distance per day as 5 miles, and select one of the "severe" driving conditions, it will show a 3000 mile suggested interval. If fact, if I choose any total miles or miles per day and "normal", it suggest a 5000 mile interval. Any total miles and miles per day and any condition other than normal results in a 3000 mile interval.

Obviously, they did think it important do differentiate it, but they did not feel that it needed to be shared with the person buying the vehicle. Or maybe, they found out that they needed to make the distinction after 2002. Either way, the way I use my Sport Trac requires a more frequent oil change than I was lead to believe when I purchased the vehicle. Fortunately for me, I have pretty much maintained a 3000 - 3500 mile interval in spite of what the maintenance schedule provided with the vehicle stated.

Installed:
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Chuckster BAK, Trailer Hitch and Cooler Rack
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Paint HF Tag Along Trailer to Match Bike

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post #39 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-03-2019, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by btom View Post
either dino oil or synthetic oil will both get dirty the same, so extend the drain interval for your synthetic oil and run your bike more miles on dirty oil, it's your motor
Dirt isn't the main reason you buy synthetic oil. Unless you live on a dirt road, it's less the dirt and more the loss of oil viscosity (the ability of oil to remain both fluid and lubricating in specified temperature ranges) over repeated heat/cooling cycles that causes damage. Synthetic oil provides longer viscosity life, as much as twice over. Other advantages:

Uniform molecular size means less friction
Refinement and engineering reduce deposits
Additives boost protection and can clean engines
Better function in cold and extreme weather
Cleaner oil with fewer impurities

https://www.idrivesafely.com/defensi...nventional-oil

Last edited by Patrick's1500; 07-03-2019 at 09:35 AM.
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post #40 of 56 (permalink) Old 07-03-2019, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabre-t View Post
Well, I think that is a rather naive viewpoint. The manual for my 2002 Ford Sport Trac calls for oil changes every 5000 miles. There is no mention at all of any differences for "normal" vs "severe" conditions.
It's weird that oil and vehicles is a lot like plumbing- nothing is standard and there are too many choices to make, and the wrong one can really affect your motorcycle, especially wet clutches. Standardization would be a little easier.

My old 1992 Toyot Hi-lux pickup had specific intervals listed for ideal, normal and severe weather/dust and sand. 7500 miles ideal conditions, 5000 normal, 3500 severe.

My 2008 Expedition schedule says every 7500 miles, no qualifiers. But the 2007 and before models said 5,000 miles. So I just treat it like the Hi-lux, except I use full synth and run the changes out to 7500-10k miles.
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