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Old 01-08-2013, 05:36 PM   #61
Chas63
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Originally Posted by reddyford View Post
Even the Santa Maria had the Niņa and the Pinta. Lets expand our horizons and envision a flagship (1700) followed by the 900 and 1200 cruisers. We'll take a small lose in tooling up the 1200 engine the first year (using the 900 frame) but the legion of bikers that desire that 12 to 1300 cc size cruiser will be won back two fold.
Precisely! The smart manufacturers produce what the customers want. The dumb ones say, "This is all we've got, so take your pick". The customer will take their pick all right....... they'll pick a competitors product.

Even if it were true that Kaw could only justify producing two touring style bikes, they would do a lot better producing the 1200 (at the size and weight of the current 900) and the 1700. For every one sale that they would lose because the larger engine bike cost pennies more per day for fuel and insurance, they would gain 10 sales because of the much better performance of a mid-weight touring bike with big bike performance.
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Old 01-08-2013, 05:54 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by Scott_in_TX View Post
Hey Chas,

Just a couple quick questions.

What is it about the EGC specifically that makes you want a second cruiser?

Have you thought about replacing the EGC with a better handling bagger?

Why not just get the Sportster1200, the V-star 1300, or the Honda Interstate?

Scott
Actually, there's not a thing wrong with the EGC that makes me want a second cruiser/touring bike. The reason I want a second bike is because I'm fortunate enough to have two homes. One home is in Florida and the other in Tennessee. I'm getting tired of trailering my Harley back and forth twice per year so I'm looking to buy another bike to leave in TN while I leave the Harley in FL. That way, whichever place I'm at, I'll have a bike to ride. It would be nice to have a big Harley at each place, but I can't justify spending that much $$$ on a second bike, so I'm looking for a less expensive touring style bike for my TN riding.

And, in fact, I found that bike this afternoon. I bought a 2009 Vulcan Classic 900 LT. It's a one owner bike which had good care taken of it. Has about 10,500 miles on it. Got it at a good price, IMO. Of course, I would have been happier if it had a 1200 cc engine in it, but I think this 900 cc engine will be satisfactory for my style of riding.

BTW, if the bike turns out to be a lemon, I'm coming after you guys who talked me into buying it. Now you can tell your buddies you talked a Harley guy into buying a Kawasaki........ but I didn't get rid of my Harley. No way, Amigo.
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Old 01-08-2013, 06:27 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by Chas63 View Post
Precisely! The smart manufacturers produce what the customers want. The dumb ones say, "This is all we've got, so take your pick". The customer will take their pick all right....... they'll pick a competitors product.

Even if it were true that Kaw could only justify producing two touring style bikes, they would do a lot better producing the 1200 (at the size and weight of the current 900) and the 1700. For every one sale that they would lose because the larger engine bike cost pennies more per day for fuel and insurance, they would gain 10 sales because of the much better performance of a mid-weight touring bike with big bike performance.
This is a ridicules self serving statement,
Quote:
they would do a lot better producing the 1200 (at the size and weight of the current 900
2 engine sizes, one has 4 models, the other has 3 ... they recently dropped 2 engine sizes, the 500 and the 1600 .... for obvious reasons. How many is enough.

It is conclusive that you can never appease a 100% of the people all of the time.Smart companies go for mass sales ... not trying to make minority purchasers happy.

You want a 1200 ... the next guy says, why have a 1200 when a 1300 has more power. Its the dog chasing is own tail syndrome.

Yamaha has down sized its range (no 650) and i suspect the 1100 is on its way out as well.

If you think multiple bikes in the range is a great idea .... just ask GM ... multiple cars in multiple models in multiple brands went far from creating them success.

HD has had more chapter 11's than most companies have hot dinners .. i doubt if their business model is the road map to business success.

Think your in the majority ... this is the first post on the forum that i have seen regarding no 1200cc model which leads me to surmise that, while some have comments on the matter, it is not really a sales issue for Kawasaki.

Romans posts are right on the money ... its all about business costs vs profit vs sales., and I'm sure the Kawasaki marketing group has considered all the profitable options.

BTW .. congrats on the "9" ... your post came up during the typing of this reply.
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Old 01-08-2013, 06:50 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas63 View Post
Actually, there's not a thing wrong with the EGC that makes me want a second cruiser/touring bike. The reason I want a second bike is because I'm fortunate enough to have two homes. One home is in Florida and the other in Tennessee. I'm getting tired of trailering my Harley back and forth twice per year so I'm looking to buy another bike to leave in TN while I leave the Harley in FL. That way, whichever place I'm at, I'll have a bike to ride. It would be nice to have a big Harley at each place, but I can't justify spending that much $$$ on a second bike, so I'm looking for a less expensive touring style bike for my TN riding.

And, in fact, I found that bike this afternoon. I bought a 2009 Vulcan Classic 900 LT. It's a one owner bike which had good care taken of it. Has about 10,500 miles on it. Got it at a good price, IMO. Of course, I would have been happier if it had a 1200 cc engine in it, but I think this 900 cc engine will be satisfactory for my style of riding.

BTW, if the bike turns out to be a lemon, I'm coming after you guys who talked me into buying it. Now you can tell your buddies you talked a Harley guy into buying a Kawasaki........ but I didn't get rid of my Harley. No way, Amigo.
There is a problem with the EGC....it is in the wrong location!

I was trying to figure out why you had a 88ci (1442cc) yet wanted to fill a deficiency with a 1200cc.
Location!!

I am sure there are some buyers that will go to Honda, Yamaha, or HD. If you are looking for a 250 from a major brand there are only a couple of places to get one of those.
I would not be surprised to see the 1700 go away and be replaced with a re-engineered V2K. If that happened; there would definately be a large enough gap to fill with a larger mid-size.

In any case; congratulations on the 900. It will never sound like a Harley; but it should get you where you want to go faster than you SHOULD be riding. And it should be a lot of fun!

Scott
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Old 01-09-2013, 10:30 AM   #65
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I hear what you're saying about horsepower and weight and all that, but (no offense intended), I'm not sure that you are hearing me. So I'll make my point one more time.

Harley increased the 883 Sportster engine to 1200 cc and significantly increased the torque and horsepower without increasing the weight at all. If Harley can do it, then why don't you think that Kawasaki can do it?
Well, if HD can do it, I guess so could Kawasaki. No doubt they could add a hundred cc to the 900 engine without adding any weight, simply by lengthening the stroke with a shorter rod and shorter piston. Or something like that. I'm not an engine designer, so I really couldn't say. In the end, though, as has been previously stated in this thread, it's all about sales, money and profit--cost effectiveness for Kawasaki. It seems they have a good thing going for them with the 900 and 1700 series, and I doubt they are about to mess with a solid market.

Personally, neither of the Sporty's would do it for me. Bad fit. The only two that I'd look at would be the Road King or the Road Glide Ultra.
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Old 01-09-2013, 10:43 AM   #66
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Well, if HD can do it, I guess so could Kawasaki. No doubt they could add a hundred cc to the 900 engine without adding any weight, simply by lengthening the stroke with a shorter rod and shorter piston. Or something like that. I'm not an engine designer, so I really couldn't say. In the end, though, as has been previously stated in this thread, it's all about sales, money and profit--cost effectiveness for Kawasaki. It seems they have a good thing going for them with the 900 and 1700 series, and I doubt they are about to mess with a solid market.

Personally, neither of the Sporty's would do it for me. Bad fit. The only two that I'd look at would be the Road King or the Road Glide Ultra.
isn't that what Kawasaki essentially done with the 1500 when they went to the 1600 engines? And Yamaha with the 750-1100 Virago
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Old 01-09-2013, 11:10 AM   #67
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I have nothing against HD motorcycles. I have only ridden 3 different ones. An 883, a 1200, and an ultra classic. The thing I have against the sportsturds is that I don't like the way the fell so small. I have spent most of my time on Larger framed bikes (1500 classic, 1600 Meanie, V2K). I have also owned (between me and my wife) a 650 honda nighthawk, 1100 yamaha v star, 125 eliminator and 600 honda VLX.
That's what I enjoy about the 1200 as a second scoot. It's like all together a different ride than my 1500 and compliments the experience, IMO. I don't feel cramped being 5' 11" but really love climbing back on the Vulcan and stretching out.
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Old 01-09-2013, 11:22 AM   #68
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That's what I enjoy about the 1200 as a second scoot. It's like all together a different ride than my 1500 and compliments the experience, IMO. I don't feel cramped being 5' 11" but really love climbing back on the Vulcan and stretching out.
I did not feel cramped up on the bike. I just don't like how Skinny they feel. I feel like I am riding a bicycle I don't have to pedal. Nothing against the performance. Has plenty of enough power just the width make me feel weird.
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Old 01-09-2013, 01:39 PM   #69
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Congrats on your purchse chas. Any way you cut it the 900 is a great ride.

As for the 1200, HD's, GM's and the rest of it... Why not keep the existing 900 as is as you mention, however upgrade the engine to a 1200 and use GM's marketing scheme while embedding the HD trademark and call it:

VN900HDLT

Now everybody's happy...

You get:

1) 1200 in a 900 (Heavy Duty) package
2) Same everything else in the pre-existing 900
3) All interchangeable accessories.
4) No changes to KW's marketing/production line-up
5) Maintain your existing fellowship while garnering another market group
6) Slight performance boosts
7) Maintain same insurance rates (its a 900HD not a 1200!)
8) Minimal production costs
9) HD could play on the "H"arley "D"avidson
10) You can still carry an "i" whatever on it...

and on and on...

I'd buy one!

Have fun riding...lol

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Old 01-09-2013, 05:42 PM   #70
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This is a ridicules self serving statement,


Yamaha has down sized its range (no 650) and i suspect the 1100 is on its way out as well.

If
They have? Here In Oz there is still a 650 (custom & classic) with 6 different cruiser engines overall. I haven't seen a 2013 catalogue yet so maybe they will be missing in that?
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